Politics

Discussion relating to current events, politics, religion, etc
Message
Author
User avatar
mockbee
Posts: 2321
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 12:05 am

Re: Politics

#61 Post by mockbee » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:49 am

Hype wrote:
Sun Nov 11, 2018 5:31 pm
I can see how someone who isn't racist might have voted for an already racist candidate. But I can't see how anyone who isn't racist could vote for him again and still not be racist. Voting for Trump in 2020 will be a racist act whether anyone likes it or not. Listen to Steve Bannon. Whether this "helps" or not is irrelevant. It needs to be said.
I agree it would be a racist act, and I think that it was a racist act the first time. It should be acknowledged.

If it is framed that 50% of Americans are beyond redemption, out and out racists by a group of elite liberals though, that just won't work. Democrats can't let Trump frame that debate.

Obama was really, really smart.

User avatar
Hype
Posts: 6643
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:44 pm

Re: Politics

#62 Post by Hype » Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:26 am

mockbee wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:49 am
Hype wrote:
Sun Nov 11, 2018 5:31 pm
I can see how someone who isn't racist might have voted for an already racist candidate. But I can't see how anyone who isn't racist could vote for him again and still not be racist. Voting for Trump in 2020 will be a racist act whether anyone likes it or not. Listen to Steve Bannon. Whether this "helps" or not is irrelevant. It needs to be said.
I agree it would be a racist act, and I think that it was a racist act the first time. It should be acknowledged.

If it is framed that 50% of Americans are beyond redemption, out and out racists by a group of elite liberals though, that just won't work. Democrats can't let Trump frame that debate.

Obama was really, really smart.
Yeah. So, I have it on pretty good authority that Booker is that same type, at least in theory, and always has been (I know people who knew him at Oxford / Yale -- like Clinton, Obama, etc., he was thinking 20 years ahead...). That's why I've said that he's likely to have a good shot at beating Trump, unless he does something disastrously stupid, or fails to capture enough of the Midwest vote that Clinton absolutely tanked.

lollapaloser
Posts: 232
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2011 6:42 pm

Re: Politics

#63 Post by lollapaloser » Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:35 pm

Booker's got a confirmed groping in his past though doesn't he?

User avatar
mockbee
Posts: 2321
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 12:05 am

Re: Politics

#64 Post by mockbee » Tue Nov 13, 2018 6:14 pm

lollapaloser wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:35 pm
Booker's got a confirmed groping in his past though doesn't he?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/mor ... c233484719

This would be a non-issue with a swing voter, but I don't know how he gets out of a competitive primary in our current climate.

I've not been terribly impressed by the guy. :noclue:

User avatar
Hype
Posts: 6643
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:44 pm

Re: Politics

#65 Post by Hype » Tue Nov 13, 2018 8:12 pm

mockbee wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 6:14 pm
lollapaloser wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:35 pm
Booker's got a confirmed groping in his past though doesn't he?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/mor ... c233484719

This would be a non-issue with a swing voter, but I don't know how he gets out of a competitive primary in our current climate.

I've not been terribly impressed by the guy. :noclue:
That is a very different case than the MeToo stuff though... :confused: We'll see.

User avatar
chaos
Posts: 4488
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:23 pm
Location: Boston

Re: Politics

#66 Post by chaos » Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:33 pm


User avatar
Hokahey
Site Admin
Posts: 4080
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 3:51 pm

Re: Politics

#67 Post by Hokahey » Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:49 pm

chaos wrote:
Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:33 pm
That pause makes it sooooo awkward and funny.

User avatar
SR
Posts: 6991
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2011 12:56 pm

Re: Politics

#68 Post by SR » Wed Apr 17, 2019 4:49 am


User avatar
SR
Posts: 6991
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2011 12:56 pm

Re: Politics

#69 Post by SR » Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:32 am

And taking office in Alberta as Premier-designate, Jason Kenney? Is this a pervasive shift in Canada? :banghead:

User avatar
Hype
Posts: 6643
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:44 pm

Re: Politics

#70 Post by Hype » Fri Apr 19, 2019 1:07 am

SR wrote:
Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:32 am
And taking office in Alberta as Premier-designate, Jason Kenney? Is this a pervasive shift in Canada? :banghead:
Yes. Russian money has been funding anti-Trudeau sentiment for years on social media.

There's a concerted effort of fascist-minded wealthy elites in foreign places to mess with the international order. This sounds like a conspiracy, but it's not unified, it's just that it makes a lot of sense for a place as fucked as Russia to do what they're doing, and they've been perfecting it for a while, so now we're seeing the results.

User avatar
SR
Posts: 6991
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2011 12:56 pm

Re: Politics

#71 Post by SR » Fri Apr 19, 2019 4:42 am

He's poisoned so much and the march continues. Putin is formidable

User avatar
chaos
Posts: 4488
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:23 pm
Location: Boston

Re: Politics

#72 Post by chaos » Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:07 pm


https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-48007487

Ukraine election: Comedian Zelensky wins presidency by landslide
22 April 2019

Ukrainian comedian Volodymyr Zelensky has scored a landslide victory in the country's presidential election.

With nearly all ballots counted in the run-off vote, Mr Zelensky had taken more than 73% with incumbent Petro Poroshenko trailing far behind on 24%.

"I will never let you down," Mr Zelensky told celebrating supporters.

Russia says it wants him to show "sound judgement", "honesty" and "pragmatism" so that relations can improve. Russia backs separatists in eastern Ukraine.

The comments came from Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev, in a Facebook post on Monday (in Russian).

He said he expected Mr Zelensky to "repeat familiar ideological formulas" that he used in the election campaign, adding: "I have no illusions on that score.

"At the same time, there is a chance to improve relations with our country."

Mr Poroshenko, who admitted defeat after the first exit polls were published, has said he will not be leaving politics.

He told voters that Mr Zelensky, 41, was too inexperienced to stand up to Russia effectively.

Mr Zelensky, a political novice, is best known for starring in a satirical television series Servant of the People, in which his character accidentally becomes Ukrainian president.


Image


He told reporters he would "reboot" peace talks with the separatists fighting Ukrainian forces and volunteers in the east
.
"I think that we will have personnel changes. In any case we will continue in the direction of the Minsk [peace] talks and head towards concluding a ceasefire," he said.

There are sporadic skirmishes and the situation also remains tense around Crimea, annexed from Ukraine by Russia in 2014.


User avatar
Hype
Posts: 6643
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:44 pm

Re: Politics

#73 Post by Hype » Wed Apr 24, 2019 7:29 pm

chaos wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:07 pm

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-48007487

Ukraine election: Comedian Zelensky wins presidency by landslide
22 April 2019

Ukrainian comedian Volodymyr Zelensky has scored a landslide victory in the country's presidential election.

With nearly all ballots counted in the run-off vote, Mr Zelensky had taken more than 73% with incumbent Petro Poroshenko trailing far behind on 24%.

"I will never let you down," Mr Zelensky told celebrating supporters.

Russia says it wants him to show "sound judgement", "honesty" and "pragmatism" so that relations can improve. Russia backs separatists in eastern Ukraine.

The comments came from Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev, in a Facebook post on Monday (in Russian).

He said he expected Mr Zelensky to "repeat familiar ideological formulas" that he used in the election campaign, adding: "I have no illusions on that score.

"At the same time, there is a chance to improve relations with our country."

Mr Poroshenko, who admitted defeat after the first exit polls were published, has said he will not be leaving politics.

He told voters that Mr Zelensky, 41, was too inexperienced to stand up to Russia effectively.

Mr Zelensky, a political novice, is best known for starring in a satirical television series Servant of the People, in which his character accidentally becomes Ukrainian president.


Image


He told reporters he would "reboot" peace talks with the separatists fighting Ukrainian forces and volunteers in the east
.
"I think that we will have personnel changes. In any case we will continue in the direction of the Minsk [peace] talks and head towards concluding a ceasefire," he said.

There are sporadic skirmishes and the situation also remains tense around Crimea, annexed from Ukraine by Russia in 2014.

This is way easier to understand if you take into account that Russia has tried to insist on Russian-friendly (i.e., puppet) leaders for former Soviet states since their independences in the early 90s. There was an "Orange Revolution" in Ukraine back in the early 2000s after a pro-Putin leader named Yanukovych was "elected" in widely disputed elections. After protests, a recount/runoff was held, and it was determined that one of the leaders of the revolution, Viktor Yushchenko, would be the new President. At the time, it was widely believed that Yushchenko had been poisoned with digoxin (presumably by the Russians), which left him with a disfigured face. Yushchenko and Yulia Timoshenko were widely held as pro-European heroes who would bring closer ties with the E.U.

Fast-forward a few years, and there appears to have been some infighting between these two, with Timoshenko ending up in considerable trouble (including being jailed for corruption). There were also harsh winters where Russia simply turned off the natural gas to Ukraine (accused them of stealing it), and insisted that they pay market rates, despite historic reasons why Ukraine was, like the rest of the ex-Soviet states, in no position to be paying Western market rates for gas from their former imperial overlords (a very tricky situation). Then, Yushchenko loses an election to, you guessed it, the old Russian-backed Yanukovych, who becomes President again. This time... it seems that Ukraine has simply realized it's time to get closer to Russia again, though Yanukovych had appeared to be ready to sign an "association agreement" with the EU, despite trying to also maintain closer ties to Russia. Yanukovych's reneging on the association agreement seems to have been the main impetus for the Euromaidan protests in 2013. (But it's also possible that Russia was involved in fomenting this as a pretext for the later invasion.) These protests led to the ouster of Yanukovych, who fled to Russia, and new elections. Weirdly, around this time audio was leaked of United States officials backing a guy named Arseniy Yatsenyuk for Prime Minister. Whether through direct or indirect means, American support seems to have paid off and Yatsenyuk, along with chocolate baron Poroshenko end up as the new leaders, with a decidedly pro-Western outlook. Meanwhile, Russia is engaging in an invasion without admitting it, and manage to annex Crimea under the pretext of a referendum which independent reporters widely suspected was a sham (though there is admittedly fairly widespread pro-Russian support in these regions).

That's the backdrop for what has just happened -- as far as I can tell, Russian backing seems to be behind Zelenskiy's win, and that seems born out in his subtle backtracking of the pro-EU Poroshenko policies, especially regarding the ongoing war in the east of the country.

It's really a mess though.

User avatar
SR
Posts: 6991
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2011 12:56 pm

Re: Politics

#74 Post by SR » Thu Apr 25, 2019 5:57 am

His reach is extending rapidly. It's really alarming. Here in the US, by the limited info being reported (and distorted), all indicators are that we have lost the battles in the last few years and the war looks almost insurmountable....willful ignorance/willing victims. :banghead:

User avatar
drwintercreeper
Posts: 71
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2011 7:57 am

Re: Politics

#75 Post by drwintercreeper » Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:38 am

I am waiting to see how the dust settles. Zelensky won nearly every region of Ukraine except the far west (and he still did well there), so in that sense this election was the cleanest yet in that it didn't break down across traditional cleavages (language being the most salient). I wonder if this was more of a rejection of Poroshenko and his record or a rejection of his nationalist party platform (army/language/faith).

User avatar
chaos
Posts: 4488
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 7:23 pm
Location: Boston

Re: Politics

#76 Post by chaos » Tue May 21, 2019 1:57 pm

Jesus Christ. This country runs despite itself. DJT's cabinet is useless (yeah, I know, I 'm stating the obvious). :scared:

User avatar
Pandemonium
Posts: 5329
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 3:18 pm

Re: Politics

#77 Post by Pandemonium » Fri May 24, 2019 1:18 pm

chaos wrote:
Tue May 21, 2019 1:57 pm
Jesus Christ. This country runs despite itself. DJT's cabinet is useless (yeah, I know, I 'm stating the obvious). :scared:
Carson's a buffoon. It's incomprehensible that he is or was a neurosurgeon.

At least he didn't ask about REO Speedwagon.

User avatar
SR
Posts: 6991
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2011 12:56 pm

Re: Politics

#78 Post by SR » Thu Jun 06, 2019 7:44 am

Light reading for the D-Day remembrance
https://www.abebooks.com/book-search/ti ... churchill/

User avatar
kv
Posts: 7671
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 3:08 pm
Location: South Bay, SoCal

Re: Politics

#79 Post by kv » Thu Jun 06, 2019 2:29 pm

:tiphat:

I really should get those...


It's strange how people change differently with or without the change of time...

Before the internet I was a voracious book reader of anything non fiction (I'd spent my youth in fiction land)

Now I am a voracious internet user, musician and video game player lol..I watch little TV...useless it is live sports or news...ya live content...not pre-recorded ironically...TV and books sleep the fuck out of my brain now...and while I'm certain I am gleaning knowledge at at a greater rate these days, I'm aware that I'm controlling my viewpoint too much... where a good book is a separate stream from your own thought and can drag you along out your set.


I should read more books... :lolol:

.

User avatar
Bandit72
Posts: 2711
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2011 12:04 am
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: Politics

#80 Post by Bandit72 » Tue Jul 23, 2019 1:40 pm

Okayyyyy, so now we now have a c*nt in charge of the United States and a c*nt in charge of the United Kingdom.

Post Reply