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Hokahey
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Re: Politics

#151 Post by Hokahey » Fri Jan 03, 2020 9:27 pm

chaos wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 9:21 pm
Yeah, and I'm freaking out. :scared: :nyrexall:

Why?

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mockbee
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Re: Politics

#152 Post by mockbee » Sat Jan 04, 2020 6:02 am

Image
Brent Crude Oil prices 'surge'.......? Stocks 'plummet'....? :confused:

The New York Times has gone wacko, like cable news did decades ago......
NYT still have some good content and editorials but 60% is now just garbage..... :noclue: :crazy:

I've never been more at ease since I stopped following any sort of news a last year and if I catch a rumor something is up check a few sources a couple days after the fact..
:tiphat:

Try it! It's good for your health and extends life by 8-15 years! :nod: :wink:

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chaos
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Re: Politics

#153 Post by chaos » Sun Jan 05, 2020 12:03 pm

Present. :eyes:

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Re: Politics

#154 Post by phenobarb_bambalam » Mon Jan 06, 2020 12:55 am

Hokahey wrote:
Fri Jan 03, 2020 9:27 pm
chaos wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 9:21 pm
Yeah, and I'm freaking out. :scared: :nyrexall:

Why?
Why? Does that really need to be asked when you have two an imbecile on a campaign of distraction going up against a bunch of zealots? US-Iran relations have been close to or on the brink for decades, but this pushes things to the precipice - if not over. At least in the past, there was a State Department that was intact, and a cabinet to advise the Commander in Chief. It's 2020 - the Commander in Chief has all but dismantled the State Department, so there is little to fall back on in terms of diplomacy, there is no voice of reason within the administration, and the CiC has no grasp of history or Middle Eastern politics. War with Iran is a very different proposition to what the US undertook in Afghanistan or Iraq - one that will spill over far beyond Iranian borders.
mockbee wrote:
Fri Jan 03, 2020 8:40 pm
Do you beleive Bin Laden should not have been taken out either?
The comparison just doesn't stand up. No matter what Suleimani was responsible for in terms of his actions, he was an Iranian government official who has been assassinated.

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Re: Politics

#155 Post by mockbee » Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:38 am

phenobarb_bambalam wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 12:55 am


Why? Does that really need to be asked when you have two an imbecile on a campaign of distraction going up against a bunch of zealots? US-Iran relations have been close to or on the brink for decades, but this pushes things to the precipice - if not over. At least in the past, there was a State Department that was intact, and a cabinet to advise the Commander in Chief. It's 2020 - the Commander in Chief has all but dismantled the State Department, so there is little to fall back on in terms of diplomacy, there is no voice of reason within the administration, and the CiC has no grasp of history or Middle Eastern politics. War with Iran is a very different proposition to what the US undertook in Afghanistan or Iraq - one that will spill over far beyond Iranian borders.
If you feel that you are right and you truly believe this and Iran truly believes this, we will be okay. Think about it.

As fucked up as it may sound, I think Trump knows what he is doing. I know that sounds totally fucked up.
It is really risky what he did, like the greatest risk of our lifetime, but the alternative was Suleimani eventually controlling the region.

Obama and W wanted to take him out, and I believe would have if they knew the fallout would not be disastrous. It may actually have been disastrous with them doing that, because Iran would know they would always "fall back on diplomacy" and Iran would have carte blanche to create trouble.

Yeah, if the Iranian government decides to go rouge, we are in for a disaster of catastrophic proportions. Or....if not, we may be in for a time of peace we have not seen in our lifetimes. Peace, in a tremendously fraught situation, only comes at the brink of war. Iran was not looking to negotiate. Let me correct that, Iran is looking for peace. Suleimani demonstrated time and time again he was not, the farthest from it in fact. Now he is gone from the picture.

Lets check back in 6 months, I truly believe this will be little to nothing in terms of consequences. Iraq and Iran need to flex their muscles right now, and that makes sense, but both countries powers that be I really believe are breathing huge sighs of relief. Yes, diplomats, expats and Western citizens are at heightened risk, but they have ALWAYS been at heightened risk. Did Death to America start last week?

I am not rah-rahing this action of taking Suleimani out. I think it was ridiculously risky. But I see a silver lining. :noclue:

Also, let me make it clear, I have no love for Trump and I would never vote for him. He is a fucking asshole of colossal proportions, who doesn't give a shit about his own people and has destroyed our future with his tax cuts, rhetoric on immigration and dismantling environmental regulation directives. :no: :banghead:

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Re: Politics

#156 Post by Hokahey » Mon Jan 06, 2020 9:06 am

phenobarb_bambalam wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 12:55 am
Hokahey wrote:
Fri Jan 03, 2020 9:27 pm
chaos wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 9:21 pm
Yeah, and I'm freaking out. :scared: :nyrexall:

Why?
Why? Does that really need to be asked when you have two an imbecile on a campaign of distraction going up against a bunch of zealots? US-Iran relations have been close to or on the brink for decades, but this pushes things to the precipice - if not over. At least in the past, there was a State Department that was intact, and a cabinet to advise the Commander in Chief. It's 2020 - the Commander in Chief has all but dismantled the State Department, so there is little to fall back on in terms of diplomacy, there is no voice of reason within the administration, and the CiC has no grasp of history or Middle Eastern politics. War with Iran is a very different proposition to what the US undertook in Afghanistan or Iraq - one that will spill over far beyond Iranian borders.
mockbee wrote:
Fri Jan 03, 2020 8:40 pm
Do you beleive Bin Laden should not have been taken out either?
The comparison just doesn't stand up. No matter what Suleimani was responsible for in terms of his actions, he was an Iranian government official who has been assassinated.
I don't believe I was talking to you.

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Re: Politics

#157 Post by phenobarb_bambalam » Tue Jan 07, 2020 1:57 am

mockbee wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:38 am

As fucked up as it may sound, I think Trump knows what he is doing. I know that sounds totally fucked up.
It is really risky what he did, like the greatest risk of our lifetime, but the alternative was Suleimani eventually controlling the region.
Respectfully, the notion to he knows what he's doing is laughable. The timing of this makes it so transparent that this act had little to do with a necessary or strategic course of action - it's all about creating a distraction from the impeachment situation.

He has done nothing but alienate allies over the last three years and made a series of messed up foreign policy moves, all whilst touting an agenda that has seen the US withdraw from spheres of influence it's been crucial in for decades. There is no plan here - no noble pursuit.

In June, Iran shot down a US military aircraft in international airspace. He did nothing. In September, they attacked a Saudi Arabian oil facility. No US action. Now, all of a sudden - there is a mad move. If there was an imminent threat to the US, where was the briefing within government (people at Mar-a-Lago had a sense, apparently) and where is the evidence now? And if there was some masterplan to be foiled, was this really the way to foil it - by removing a commander, who would ultimately be replaced? This was not about saving lives (American or otherwise) and it wasn't about regional peace. This was a political move (domestic), but it's clear that it will work counter to both of those things.

There will have been plenty of reasons and opportunities to take Suleimani out. Yes, the world is a better place for his assassination, but at what cost? As you say, the risk of it has been too great for administrations that functioned fully (whether one agreed with the policies or not). This man who is a known liar and a laughing stock on the world stage and his corrupt administration is hardly a the source of a silver lining. And I don't think it will take anywhere close to six months to see what chaos will unfold. So far today, he's spouted off on Twitter about striking Iranian cultural sites - which goes against the Geneva Convention and would essentially be a war crime if carried out. That's not knowing what he's doing. He's withdrawn from the fight against ISIS in order to reposition those forces - leaving things wide open for ISIS. That, too, is not a sign of knowing what he is doing.

For 41 years, US-Iranian relations have been a clusterfuck, but successive administrations have avoided direct conflict. It's impossible to see how this reckless act won't tip the balance towards disaster.

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Re: Politics

#158 Post by mockbee » Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:40 am

1. Do you think there is a possibility that Rhouhani and Khamenei wanted Suleimani out?

2. Surely you believe there is no love lost between Iraq and Iran meddling in their affairs via Suleimani?

3. Would not responding to those Iranian offensives make Suleimani a softer target?

3. If Trump is truly crazy as you repeatedly point out would Iran be so stupid as to test him?

:noclue:
:tiphat:

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Re: Politics

#159 Post by Hype » Tue Jan 07, 2020 4:53 pm

I think it's worth paying attention to the bigger picture. The Iran / Saudi proxy-war in the middle east is really a proxy war between the United States (and allies) and Russia and (sort of, sometimes) China. The money for Hezbollah and Hamas comes from Iran. The money for rebels in Yemen comes from Iran. The money for rebels in Syria comes from the United States. The money for rebels in Libya and elsewhere, also comes from the United States. The money for the Taliban originally came from the United States, to fight against Russian occupation of Afghanistan.

Souleimani was considered a terrorist by Americans because he was the one masterminding a lot of Iran's management and funding of the groups that the United States has been fighting in Iraq and elsewhere. But ultimately these are supported by Russian and Chinese weapons. Consider this: https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/m ... i-killing/

Trump's decision to act on an existing plan to take out Souleimani now is ill-timed and petty, since, frankly, as far as I can tell he has seemed to be less of a war hawk than Hillary Clinton (and famously didn't like Bolton's extreme hawkishness). Trump is also not known to be interested in long-term strategic thinking of the sort that would be required for a full-scale invasion/war. He seems to be much more interested in having bargaining chips / cards to say (stupid) things like "Obama killed Bin Laden, but I killed Souleimani -- much worse... big. Big bad guy. Bad guy. Much worse than Bin Laden." Which, frankly, is probably why they've timed this intentionally for this election season.

Long-term, I'm not sure what to think, but it's pretty clear that the United States can't continue burning money on perpetual war while China keeps improving at the rate it has been. It's a great example of a "Red Queen Paradox", where you have to keep running to stay in the same spot, and accelerate if you want to move forwards at all. The United States under Trump has not been, unfortunately, in most cases, running at all.

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Re: Politics

#160 Post by mockbee » Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:59 pm

So in your estimation results may be good, but reasoning is fakey....?

But, you assigned the reasoning....? :noclue:

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chaos
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Re: Politics

#161 Post by chaos » Tue Jan 07, 2020 6:14 pm

And so it begins . . .

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Re: Politics

#162 Post by mockbee » Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:10 pm

WASHINGTON -- President Donald Trump has responded to Tuesday night’s attack by Iran on US and coalition forces stationed at bases in Iraq.

“All is well! Missiles launched from Iran at two military bases located in Iraq,” Trump tweeted. “Assessment of casualties & damages taking place now. So far, so good! We have the most powerful and well equipped military anywhere in the world, by far! I will be making a statement tomorrow morning.”

Shortly after 5 p.m. on Tuesday, Iran launched more than a dozen ballistic missiles against U.S. military and coalition forces in Iraq. It was not immediately clear if any U.S. service members were hurt in the strikes.

U.S. stock futures plunged on Tuesday night on news of the Iranian offensive.

Trump spent part of Tuesday night meeting with national security officials at the White House about the attacks.

Vice President Mike Pence, Secretary of Defense Mark Esper, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo and Army Gen. Mark Milley were all seen leaving the White House.

Earlier in the day on Tuesday, Trump had said the United States was “totally prepared” for Iran to retaliate.

“And likewise, we’re prepared to attack if we have to as retribution,” Trump said.

Iran’s foreign minister, Javad Zarif, said in a tweet late Tuesday that Iran “took & concluded proportionate measures in self-defense.” He added: “We do not seek escalation or war, but will defend ourselves against any aggression.”
Aaaand we're done....?

:noclue:


I think this is a coordinated effort between Iran and US.....just my hunch. :noclue: :idea:

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Re: Politics

#163 Post by mockbee » Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:48 pm

Looks like we're good. :nod:

It was tragic about the stampede..... :wavesad:

But otherwise.....
Sleep well folks! :bigrin:

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chaos
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Re: Politics

#164 Post by chaos » Thu Jan 30, 2020 10:39 am

I don't know why I'm surprised but wow. Just wow. :sui:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business ... irus-jobs/

Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross says China’s coronavirus ‘will help’ bring jobs back to U.S.
By Rachel Siegel
Jan. 30, 2020 at 11:46 a.m. EST

Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross said the Chinese coronavirus — which has killed 170 in China and infected more than 7,700 people — could “help” to bring jobs to the United States because companies will be moving operations away from impacted areas.

During an appearance Thursday morning on Fox Business, Ross said that he didn’t “want to talk about a victory lap over a very unfortunate, very malignant disease,” and expressed sympathy for the victims. But he said the pneumonia-like virus would be a consideration for American businesses that are scrambling to determine how the outbreak will affect their supply chains. He pointed to the 2003 SARS epidemic, the “African swine virus” and now coronavirus as “another risk factor that people need to take into account.”

“I think it will help to accelerate the return of jobs to North America, some to [the] U.S., probably some to Mexico as well,” Ross said. He then said Apple was “talking about figuring out how to replace some of the Chinese production.” Apple had plans to assemble some phones and computers outside China before the coronavirus outbreak.

“I think there’s a confluence of factors that will make it very, very likely more reshoring to the U.S. and some reshoring to Mexico,” Ross said.
The White House has been pressuring companies in China to move operations to the United States. President Trump recently signed a partial trade deal with China meant to create new incentives for U.S. companies.

But public health experts were quick to criticize Ross’s comments as inaccurate and dangerous, saying such messaging could suppress reports of new infections. Meanwhile, health officials are up against the spread of false information on social media, from conspiracy theories to deceitful claims of magical cures. And Facebook, Google and Twitter are scrambling to crack down on the spread of dangerous health disinformation.

Georges C. Benjamin, executive director of the American Public Health Association, said that American companies would have more reason to be concerned about gun violence or measles outbreaks stateside “in terms of actual risk to their health than coronavirus.”

“You have somebody of that stature who makes an irresponsible comment, speaking on matters in which he has no expertise, and there’s no scientific or historical evidence to what he’s saying,” Benjamin said of Ross.

“With this kind of new disease, you want as much openness as you can,” Benjamin added. “If you suppress that openness, which this will do, then you absolutely make it worse and more people will get sick, and more people will die.”

Sandro Galea, dean of the School of Public Health at Boston University, said infectious diseases “threaten all of us” and that there’s never a positive consequence from an outbreak. Ross’s comments “rest on a misunderstanding of how infectious diseases are transmitted,” Galea said.

There’s a “responsibility that public officials have to communicate in an informed manner that educates the public and moves us towards an understanding of what actually generates help,” Galea said. “A comment like this achieves the exact opposite purpose.”

...

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Re: Politics

#165 Post by mockbee » Thu Jan 30, 2020 10:47 am

This is one crazy news day..........

Conoravirus
Brexit
Impeachment
US growth stats
US-China escalations
US elections..... I think?

Oh and Bill Gates daughter just got engaged!

:jasper: :jasper: :jasper:

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Re: Politics

#166 Post by mockbee » Fri Jan 31, 2020 5:35 pm

Image



Another good day for a super long walk without the phone....... :scared:

:noclue:


:drink:

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Re: Politics

#167 Post by SR » Wed Feb 12, 2020 7:18 am

I've mentioned Parscale in the past in the form of a dire warning for 20. This is a pretty good article detailing the depths of insidiousness and the effect the misdirection of truth can have on angry people desperate to have their voice noticed. We can't manage sm, and AI is looming :lol: It makes other good points as well.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/ar ... ar/605530/

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Re: Politics

#168 Post by mockbee » Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:18 pm

SR wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 7:18 am
I've mentioned Parscale in the past in the form of a dire warning for 20. This is a pretty good article detailing the depths of insidiousness and the effect the misdirection of truth can have on angry people desperate to have their voice noticed. We can't manage sm, and AI is looming :lol: It makes other good points as well.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/ar ... ar/605530/
And still Trump and his cronies are "stupid"......... :noclue:
(yes, some are stupid, the ones in jail...... :lol: )

Maybe that is exactly what they want you to think so you (us and the rest of the superior coastal elites) continue to rest on our laurels, just wait it out, people will come to their senses......I mean for God's sake....Trump thinks Kansas City is in Kansas?!!!!! I mean really, all we gotta do is wait............. :eyes: .............. :wink:

The Dems, and all the other 'enlightened' ones, are the people wandering around in no man's land, with buckets on their heads..... :noclue:

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Re: Politics

#169 Post by kv » Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:27 pm

KC is sorta in Kansas though...it's a border city....people blew that up way too much...ya sure the chiefs are def not from Kansas...but it wasn't that asinine a statement

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Re: Politics

#170 Post by mockbee » Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:33 pm

kv wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:27 pm
KC is sorta in Kansas though...it's a border city....people blew that up way too much...ya sure the chiefs are def not from Kansas...but it wasn't that asinine a statement
No it wasn't, and I think that's always Trump's point in the "stupid" posts. There is always something there that has a grain of Truth, and media/libs blow it up. He ain't stupid.

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Re: Politics

#171 Post by Hype » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:56 pm

mockbee wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:33 pm
kv wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:27 pm
KC is sorta in Kansas though...it's a border city....people blew that up way too much...ya sure the chiefs are def not from Kansas...but it wasn't that asinine a statement
No it wasn't, and I think that's always Trump's point in the "stupid" posts. There is always something there that has a grain of Truth, and media/libs blow it up. He ain't stupid.
The problem isn't that he doesn't understand things. It's that he doesn't care. He's Homer Simpson: https://s3.amazonaws.com/v.comb.io/TdMf ... 3635493107

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Re: Politics

#172 Post by mockbee » Thu Feb 13, 2020 5:12 pm

Hype wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:56 pm
mockbee wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:33 pm
kv wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:27 pm
KC is sorta in Kansas though...it's a border city....people blew that up way too much...ya sure the chiefs are def not from Kansas...but it wasn't that asinine a statement
No it wasn't, and I think that's always Trump's point in the "stupid" posts. There is always something there that has a grain of Truth, and media/libs blow it up. He ain't stupid.
The problem isn't that he doesn't understand things. It's that he doesn't care. He's Homer Simpson: https://s3.amazonaws.com/v.comb.io/TdMf ... 3635493107
Oh, he cares biggly..... :hehe:

Well, he knows that each time tweet blows up the media, thats one less cycle where the shit he does for the elites goes unsaid.

It's the only way he goes down and he knows it.
:nod: :nod: :nod:

Media/libs haven't figured that out after 4 years, will it take another 4.....or beyond that???
:tiphat:

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SR
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Re: Politics

#173 Post by SR » Thu Feb 13, 2020 6:07 pm

:lol:

trump is smart

trump will win '20 in a landslide

Biden will be the nominee

"Lib" elites are heedless and therefore doomed

When will someone finally bring these to someone's attention?

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Re: Politics

#174 Post by mockbee » Thu Feb 13, 2020 6:20 pm

Making progress I see.

My persuasion/hypnosis is working.

I will ratchet up.

:tiphat:

:lol:

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Re: Politics

#175 Post by SR » Thu Feb 13, 2020 6:24 pm

I'd rather apply this type of fanaticism to spreads. Conjure me up some scores to bet on. :cool: :thumb:

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